A line of women aim their bows and arrows during an archery class in 1947

From Greek Peak’s Slopes to Helen Newman’s Lanes: Phys Ed Memories

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We asked you to reminisce about how you satisfied Cornell’s famed PE requirement—and without breaking a sweat, you delivered

By Melissa Newcomb & Joe Wilensky

Jamall Thompson ’14 had always been an ice hockey fan, but he’d never learned to skate. That changed his freshman spring, when he took his first phys ed course, an intro to ice skating—then enrolled in beginner ice hockey as a sophomore.

“For someone who had a fairly decent idea of the game,” the CALS alum recalls, “I quickly realized that watching the sport was definitely not the same as playing it!”

Students in a volleyball PE class play in Barton Hall
Volleyball in Barton.

Finding the hockey class “challenging but fun,” Thompson went on to take four more courses on the subject—and a decade later, he still plays regularly.

On a recent visit to campus, he even ran into his old instructor.

“We had a quick greeting before he went off to teach a group of students,” he says, “who reminded me of myself, when I was starting to play the great sport of ice hockey.”

Thompson’s favorite pastime is, in fact, just one of almost 300 ways in which today’s students can earn their required physical education credit on the Hill—home to a large, vibrant, and diverse program.

Cornell’s PE requirements trace their roots to the University’s founding, when President A.D. White stressed “physical culture” as an integral part of a college education.

Today’s undergrads have to take two PE courses (down from four in decades past) to satisfy the requirement, which can also be fulfilled by playing on an intercollegiate team or being a member of the marching band.

Women students exercising in a gym at Cornell, date unknown
Vintage scenes from a campus gym.

That makes Cornell one of three Ivies—along with Dartmouth and Columbia—that mandate physical education.

Choices range from the intense (kickboxing, trail running, rock climbing) to the chill (walking meditation, birding, backcountry photography) to the unexpected (circus arts, ballroom dancing, stress management).

Students participating in an intro to boxing class in Bartels Hall
Boxing in Bartels.

According to Jen Gudaz, senior associate director of athletics, about 10,000 students were enrolled in PE classes in 2023–24.

(Another 8,000 had fitness center memberships, and 4,600 took part in intramural sports.)

Cornell’s most recent additions to its phys ed offerings include wakeboarding, yoga trapeze, and essentials of personal training.

A karate class with a student mid kick in 1972
Karate, 1972.

The University also offers virtual PE during the summer and winter sessions, giving students a way to complete their requirements when they’re not busy with other coursework.

Some longtime favorites remain popular: in spring 2024, for example, about 600 students filled 15 sections of bowling.

Cornellians recently asked alumni to share their memories of phys ed classes across the decades—and you exceeded our expectations, with tales that were inspiring, amusing, or perhaps merely sweaty.

A yoga class (no date)
Striking a yoga pose.

“We shot targets with WWII-era rifles in the basement of Newman; I hated PE, and I could be done in 15 minutes,” recalls Suzanne Tougas Snedeker ’78 in one of our favorite entries.

“The bonus was that I posted all of my bullseyes on the bulletin board in my bedroom; I never had problems with any of my boyfriends for the rest of college.”

In her submission, Jane Capellupo ’67 laments the “horrible gym suits” that were mandated for female students of her era.

“Everyone hated them,” she says.

“Bowling at Helen Newman did not require the detested outfits, so that was a popular choice.”

And Richard Bergman ’52, MA ’54, remembers learning to ride a horse—taught by a U.S. Army sergeant “from Hollywood central casting, in uniform with Cavalry riding trousers flared at the side, who barked orders” at him and his fellow students.

“It was after we passed the sergeant’s test that the real fun began: we were allowed to ride outside of class,” says Bergman.

“One of my most pleasant memories of Cornell is my friends and I riding together in the gorges.”

Students in Kevin Seaman's Brazilian jiu-jitsu class in Bartels Hall
Brazilian jiu-jitsu.

Read on for a gymnasium’s worth of alumni PE memories—from downhill skiing to modern dance, swimming to squash.

(Submissions have been edited and condensed.)

And add your own memories in the comments!

Hitting the Slopes

“The bus [to Greek Peak] picked us up at the flagpole at the base of Libe Slope. I was fortunate to get a class on a Friday; it was a great way to blow off steam and enjoy the outdoors at the end of the week. None of us really needed lessons, but it was freeing to be an hour away from campus and enjoy the winter snow with new friends.”

— Jennifer Read Campbell ’81

Several other Southerners and I went to Greek Peak weekly. None of us had prior experience. We had fun, but none of us learned how to stop. We’d ski into the woods without colliding with the trees; our method evolved to squatting down and leaning over. Of course, all the falling left our jeans or corduroys super saturated with icy layers. Who knew that “ski pants” were acceptable garb?

— Les Abramson ’68

A ski class on the slope in 1950
Ski class on the Slope, 1950.

“By the end of the course I was quite adept, ‘wedeling’ neatly. However, on the last run of the last day, feeling relaxed and confident, enjoying a bit of sun, I encountered a bare patch. I swiveled, but the skis resolutely adhered to the rock and grass of nascent spring. I spent much of my sophomore spring with a broken tibia, on crutches.”

— Carla Bach ’79

Taking night skiing was quite an experience. Because it was so cold, most of us spent the ‘class’ time drinking hot chocolate!

Alison Kent Bermant ’70

“At the time I couldn’t understand how people could enjoy this sport, because I spent the first few sessions struggling to get up from falls! I’m happy to report that over 40 years later I’m still actively skiing, both alpine and Nordic styles.”

— Barbara Tai Roselle ’81

Discovering a Passion

“I took two semesters of fly fishing. There weren’t a lot of women into it at that time. I always felt accepted, and have made it a life-long skill. My dad used to say that he couldn’t believe he was paying Ivy League tuition for his daughter to learn to fly fish. It was worth it in the long run: we’ve taken many fly fishing trips together.”

— Edie Marshall ’96

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“Squash became a significant part of my life. Competing taught me more about others and myself than I sometimes learned in my work as a psychologist.”

Beatrice Meyer-Parsons ’82, BS ’83

“I took a fencing class with a former Olympic coach. He was wonderful, coaching only in French! I loved the class so much, I took a second semester of fencing. From there I joined the team! A wonderful memory.”

— Leslie Grushkin-Lerner ’86

(Barely) Crossing the Finish Line

“By the end of the semester, I had five water volleyball classes to make up. To teach us a lesson, the instructor required us to shower, dress, and turn in our towels after each one-hour session. After five cycles of ‘water volleyball / shower / dress / repeat,’ I was sufficiently waterlogged to learn my lesson. I made a point of enrolling only in land-based sports like golf and tennis henceforth!”

— David Freed ’75

Students during a golf class in 1950
Golf, 1950.

“I almost didn’t graduate because I could not pass golf. I was inept—the teacher finally said, ‘OK, I will pass you, but please, don’t ever come back!’ P.S.: I never picked up another golf club!”

— Nancy Cooke McAfee ’63

“As my children and grandchildren will testify, I am one of the most uncoordinated people ever! My second semester of phys ed, I was assigned to take golf—in Barton Hall, hitting balls against a canvas backdrop. I think they passed me out of pity, as I recall successfully hitting that ball at least three times!”

— Michael Steinitz ’65

No women’s changing room in the squash building; ran across the street in frigid cold, in shorts.

Karen Herrmann-Fishelson ’77

“I had failed to complete mandatory PE, but I didn’t find out until late in my senior year that the University was serious: my diploma would be withheld until I got physically educated. Fortunately, my advisor got me into a summer PE course at B.U., of all places. It involved a long commute, and a lot of enervating activity in a gym—but I got my Cornell diploma.”

— William Wroblicka ’74

“I wanted outdoor golf, but it was not offered in the fall, so I signed up for bowling. I never went. My parents did receive a notification that I was not attending classes, without specifying which—so I had some explaining to do.”

— Michael Smith ’69, BS ’70

Students in the old Sage Hall pool, circa 1920s
The long-departed Sage Hall pool, circa the 1920s.

“I managed the swim test without too much difficulty, but in the swim unit we were required to swim as much as 18 lengths. I got so exhausted that I couldn’t go to my next class. I told the coach that from then on, when I was too tired I was going to pull myself to the side of the pool and rest. He shook his head at me but didn’t object.”

— Cliff Donn ’72

“Because I was a biochemistry major and had labs almost every weekday afternoon, the only swim class available was at 5 p.m. By the time I finished, it was close to when the dorm dining room closed, so I couldn’t shower or dry my hair before racing back … in the winter.”

— Diane DeGeorge Nichols ’68

Dancing for a Diploma

“Linda Straus Pellish ’59, BArch ’60, and I needed to fit a PE class into our schedule. Modern dance! The two of us, in our black leotards, leaping through the air to whatever rhythm or music the instructor provided. Neither one of us could even begin to take it seriously. I still giggle thinking about it.”

— Diane Bishop Hanson ’59, BArch ’60

Students participate in a modern dance class in black leotards in 1966
Modern dance, 1966.

“I took intermediate ballet at Helen Newman. The gym had a polished wood floor, which was slippery. We used to sprinkle a little water in a corner to wet the soles of our slippers, giving us a bit more purchase. Eventually, a janitor complained that he had to mop up, so we had to use the water sparingly. But we managed!”

— Ellen Rieser ’76

I took modern dance, with live piano accompaniment by David Borden from the music department.

Deborah Levine ’84, BS ’85

“I joined a water ballet class. We made formations, and I remember performing what I think was called a ‘back dolphin.’ It was very exciting, mastering that move.”

— Judith Singer Bercuvitz ’60

A PE Potpourri

“I tried field hockey, thinking it would be kind of low-key, like at my high school in New Jersey. Imagine my surprise when some girls arrived carrying their own sticks. I hadn’t known it was a popular varsity sport in other parts of the country. Needless to say, I was completely outclassed.”

— Jane Capellupo ’67

Badminton was my forte; I really got into it, and somewhere in my house my trophy is still on display.

Linda Wolpert ’70

“One of the classes was Swedish massage. All students longed to take part in the teacher’s demonstration!”

— May Wong ’07

“We were issued a white blouse—no buttons—and navy shorts for [PE] class. For Rhythmics we had to wear a battleship-gray leotard, exactly like a baby’s onesie. These uniforms showed every body fault and bulge.”

— Joanne Wilson Wietgrefe ’54

“Among the offerings was the chance to have one of the polo team’s quarter horses as my responsibility. I would bring him a carrot or an apple, and he (and I) loved to gallop on the trails. It was a spectacular escape from the everyday academic pressure.”

— Julian Aroesty ’53

“Helen Newman lanes was one of the few indoor places you could still smoke, and you didn’t need to actually bowl to get credit—only show up. So some people got PE credit for smoking. I wasn’t one of them, though: I bowled three or four games each and every time.”

— Joseph Beck ’99

A Cornell ice climbing class, date unknown
Ice climbing in the Adirondacks.

“I took a weight training course, which impressed upon me how good physical exercise is for one’s studies and life in general. May our Fair Cornell also remain a fit Cornell!”

— B. Todd Shirley ’93, BA ’95

Top: Archery, 1947. (All recent photos by Sreang Hok / Cornell University; vintage images courtesy of Rare and Manuscript Collections.)

Published May 23, 2024

What’s your most vivid PE memory?


  1. Joan Kokoska, Class of 1977

    I remember taking ice skating in Lynah Rink. We learned how to do cross over turns and skate forwards and backwards! Remarkably I can still do these things on the ice!

    • Karen Zelkind Buglass, Class of 1977

      Joan, I too did ice skating and marveled how we were able to cross over and go backwards. Fond memories.

  2. Maria D. Schoen (née Reyes), Class of 1977

    I like variety so I took riflery, archery, folk dancing, and basketball. I wasn’t very good at shooting either of the weapons because my vision is not great but I enjoyed the experience. However, I learned that folk dancing was more tiring than basketball as there was hardly any rest between the songs. Since I’m only 5’3” tall, I certainly wasn’t a threat to the other team players who towered over me. The only time I had a shot at the basket was when I was fouled, but I usually made it. I looked forward to PE as a refreshing change from class studies.

  3. Keith R Molof, Class of 1979

    When I look back on my life, I used my PE classes more than I used my Industrial Engineering classes. I took ice skating and currently play senior level men’s hockey. I took skiing and wound up becoming a ski instructor and went on 5 ski trips this winter.

    I also got certified as a children’s swimming instructor to add to my Lifeguard certification. Used it to make extra money for 3 summers. And finally, I took Volleyball and joined an intramural group at Motorola in suburban Chicago to help me meet new people after I moved.

    I am very thankful Cornell required PE classes.

  4. Barry Schepp

    Why was swimming and diving nude in men’s pool. Diving could be extremely painful. After first time used all my free cuts!

  5. Dottie Hjelstrom Leelike, Class of 1966

    I took modern dance, riflery , and archery. Later in life I taught ballroom dancing at an Arthur Murray dance studio.

    • Gary Holcomb, Class of 1978

      I took bowling second semester freshman year. Actually learned to roll a hook which upped my game considerable. Bowled my first and only 200 game on my 19th birthday in Feb 1975!

  6. Beth Anderson, Class of 1980

    My mother was in the class of 1947, a time that there was a shortage of men working on campus, due to WWII. She told me that she and other women were directed to mow the campus lawns for PE credit.

  7. Roger V. Remedios, Class of 1973

    My first year as a grad student at Cornell I stayed at Kappa Alpha (since they had space for graduate students). I am from California. My first time ice skating was when the fraternity rented ice time at Lynah Rink at midnight. Since I couldn’t skate as well as others they had me play goalie. That didn’t work out well either since I allowed more goals than I blocked. I did develop a love for skating and spent quite a bit of time skating for the next years. Very memorable!

  8. Lee Clancy, Class of 1997

    Excellent piece on the PE requirement, but in the interest of providing a broader context on the topic outside Cornell, the swim test requirement specifically has been abolished by other schools. My other alma mater, Amherst College, eliminated the swim test after a student tragically drowned in 1973. Additionally, many other institutions are removing their requirements on diversity and inclusion grounds.

  9. Karen Viglione Lauterwasser, Class of 1976

    I enjoyed all my required PE. I earned my water safety instructor’s certificate, which paved the way to three summers of employment as a life guard. I also took gymnastics, ice skating and lacrosse. It was fun to try new things.

    I used to just show up at Lynah, put on my skates, and use the center ice space when other classes were going on. I did enough skating that I developed noticeable calluses on the outside edge of my pinkies from pulling my skate laces tight.

  10. Sara Britting, Class of 1977

    TO THE AUTHORS… what year was the black & white photo above (titled “vintage scenes from a campus gym”) taken? I believe my mother, Florence Swenk (Britting)‘52 is in this photo? If so, it’s one of very few I have of her when she was at Cornell. And one I’ve never seen before!

    • Joe Wilensky

      Hi, Sara, the photo is listed as undated in the system – but it could very well be of your mother! Thank you for the information!

  11. Martha Warren McKinney, Class of 1968

    I chose two semesters of modern dance. Our very stern instructor had been a student of Martha Graham, and did she ever teach us where our bodies began and ended—proprioception, they call it. That turned out to be a lifetime sense.

  12. Suzette Matthews, Class of 1975

    I took volleyball, tennis, and modern dance, all of which were wonderful and are with me to this day. One of my favorite memories of Cornell !

  13. Shelley Winkler, Class of 1976

    I was so annoyed at PE, a distraction I didn’t want (versus hanging out anywhere)! Did like folk dancing where I learned the Salty Dog Rag (still dance it today at contra dance camp!). After that class, I learned quickly that in riflery we only had to shoot one target and could leave. So riflery for the win! Then taught riflery at summer camp with my minimal background, yikes.

    • Caroline Hecht, Class of 1976

      Shelley, I was the same year as you at Cornell. We learned the Salty Dog Rag in high school in a folk dance unit in gym class. I still kind of remember it. My mom bought me the record (a 45) as a present one year

  14. Candace Kelly Crider, Class of 1965

    I took bowling in fall of 1961. We had to walk to a small bowling alley in Collegetown and spent part of class setting pins after each use. It was fun but the walk was exhausting since we had to get back to dorms on other far side of campus in time for dinner in dorm.

  15. Andrew Weber, Class of 1977

    I met my PE requirements by playing ping pong at Barton hall with the team and people from the community. We really worked up a sweat.

  16. Maura (Flood) Lentini, Class of 1995

    I remember waiting in line for hours at Teagle Hall trying to register for ballroom dancing, but that wildly popular class filled up before we could get in. I very much enjoyed bowling at Helen Newman Hall on Friday afternoons. I even taught myself to bowl left-handed. Then I enjoyed water aerobics in the spring.

  17. Leila Belkora, Class of 1987

    For PE credit, I ended up being a sort of teaching assistant for the swim test. My job was to hold the hand of anyone who was scared to get in the water, or to demonstrate strokes, because the teacher didn’t actually get in the pool as I recall. I had always swum for pleasure, so was a good swimmer, but didn’t want to be on a team or anything.

    I’m surprised no one has mentioned PE credit for ringing the chimes. I was friends with someone who did that. After climbing the stairs in the tower, I understood this was the real workout, not just jumping around pressing the pedals with one’s feet and hands.

  18. Alexandra She let Korros, Class of 1966

    I took women’s fencing the first time it was offered. Because our teacher, the assistant coach, did not speak English, the fencing coach Raul Sudre, accompanied him. We spent 90 percent of our time doing floor exercises to strengthen our ab and le muscles. At the end of class,we were taught to advance, retreat, lunge. We never touched any fencing foil. The first women who were interested in fencing stayed on for more classes and established the first women’s team. My next PE class was bowling which I took as often as I could since Helen Newman Hall had opened with its own bowling alleys. Nevertheless, the fencing experience taught me to value the strict discipline and fitness involved with excellence in every sport.

  19. Dale Grossman, Class of 1972

    When I enrolled in the fall of 1968, modern dance was required for women [but not men, of course]. I hated the thought of it so kept putting it off. I took judo and tennis freshman year. There was no fee for any PE courses when I was a student so a semester of tennis was like 10 weeks of free tennis lessons. Judo was exotic and I enjoyed the unique, but demanding, physical expeience. And I got lucky. The dance requirement was dropped my senior year.

    As an aside, I took golf lessons during intersesion one winter as a Cornell employee. There were a handful of men in the class who were clearly there to perfect their game. I was the only woman and I had never held a golf club. So again, this time for a nominal fee, I had excellent private lessons since the teaching pro did not need to spend a lot of time with the other students.

  20. frances goldberg myers, Class of 1951

    I think I go back further than any of those listed. In the class of 1951, I was one of those whose nude photo silhouettes taken on our Freshman orientation week, I believe for posture purposes. Those who didn’t pass had to take the first semester in rythmics. I passed so I went right into modern dance for the semester. Then bowling, in an alley at the edge of campus near Jim’s place (I think on Eddy street). We had to take turns setting the pins since there was no automatic pin setting . Then I took, badminton in Barton Hall, watched by all the guys. And Lastly I took two sessions of golf at the golf house on Beebe Lake I look great when we were hitting into the canvas but on the golf course I never lost a ball, never went far enough

  21. Dawn, Class of 2007

    I took a whitewater kayaking outdoor education class. We did practice at the pool on north campus, and the class culminated with an overnight trip where we kayaked on two different rivers. Seeing my instructors kayak down over a waterfall was amazing! I have loved water sports ever since!

  22. Melissa Yorks, Class of 1975

    I was clever and didn’t have to take any PE. I spent my first two years at another college and knew I wasn’t going to graduate from there so I didn’t have to worry about their requirements. The two colleges I was planning on applying to to finish my degree, Cornell and Syracuse required two years but one was during your first two years (Cornell?) and the other gave you an exemption for each semester you went elsewhere. I would have taken scuba diving at Cornell but it was always full.

  23. David Marsh, Class of 1965

    I remember taking night skiing at Greek Peak. The slopes were always icey, the roads were icier! We did a 360, on the road, not the slopes!! Scary. I did enjoy weekend hockey pickup games on Beebe Lake–although maybe not for college credit.

  24. Linda Francis Scherruble, Class of 1973

    A Fort Lauderdale native who had never seen snow before arriving learned to ski at Greek Peak for PE!

  25. Sue O’Hara, Class of 1972

    I took riding, and enjoyed learning to jump…until A) I fell off and B) the grad student instructor, who I dated a couple of times, told me I “had no legs and would need a push-button horse”!

  26. Helen Rosen Udell, Class of 1962

    I took figure skating which taught me how to skate backwards, do spins and skate with a partner. Also, I enjoyed canoeing lessons on Beebe Lake.

  27. Pia Murray, Class of 1987

    In 1985 the drinking age went from 19 to 21, and the only bar left on campus was at the bowling alley. After the first few weeks of class the instructor left us on our own with shoes and score sheet- several pitchers later we turned it in and wobbled back to the dorm. Good times.

  28. Bob Zimmerman, Class of 1969

    As I remember it, the freshman year (1965 – 1966) requirement was a rotation that familiarized me with a different athletic facility every few weeks.
    The next term, I signed up for golf. How great it was that I could spend fall afternoons strolling around the beautiful and challenging Robert Trent Jones layout out on Warren Road.
    To wrap up the obligation that spring, I decided to try something completely new to me: horseback riding. I learned walking, trotting (with posting), and cantering, and loved it all. Despite that, I failed the course! There was a no-cut policy, but I cut the last 2 classes to catch up on some heavy-duty physics classes before finals. The consequence was I still had to complete a 4th PE term, so I headed out to the golf course a few more times that fall. That was my “Don’t throw me in that briar patch, Brer Fox!” moment. What a privileged group we were!

  29. Tim Lynch, Class of 1990

    Racquetball and squash for me in freshman year. In hindsight, I wish I’d tried fencing — it’s always looked fascinating and I never wound up learning. Bowling would probably have been fun, too, though based on the statements above I might have felt out of place not drinking or smoking. 🙂

  30. Gail D Karlitz, Class of 1968

    Class of 1968: My criteria for choosing PE was that you didn’t have to change clothes or get your hair wet so you could make it to your next class. I took 2 each of bowling, archery, and ice skating.

  31. Judy Wagner, Class of 1966

    I learned the term “back yahd badmitten” in PE, thanks to two PE instructors who trained in Boston. Eek! Even badmitten had to be played like you needed to win?

  32. Alicia Schwarcz, Class of 1988

    One class I took was “intro to mountaineering”. Every week we’d do something different – climbing dams, rappeling down a gorge, across a gorge, etc. I remember telling my friends that I was scared every Friday afternoon. It was a great experience! I enjoyed trying new things each semester.

  33. Steve Pert, Class of 1981

    My roommate Alan once selected a PE class based on how late in the semester it started. His theory was that by putting it off as long as possible he might not have to ever attend. I think he took ice skating.
    I enjoyed all four of my PE classes. I took scuba diving, skiing at Greek Peak, rock climbing and riflery. In rock climbing we started with rappelling off the back of the crescent at Schoellkopf. Most weeks we rode in a van to various parks in the area, including Buttermilk Falls where we climbed the face of the dam and set up traverse ropes to cross the gorge below the dam.

  34. Terri Binder, Class of 1976

    I loved being able to take skiing at Greek Peak on Wednesday afternoons (pick up at Helen Newman Hall) to qualify for a full semester of Phys Ed since I hated all other forms of exercise (yes, I managed to pass the swim test during freshman orientation). I think we had a 1 hour group lesson then about 30 minutes to practice (free ski time). I still cringe when I remember having to learn to tackle the moguls on Elysian Fields!
    Our friends would often drive over to the slopes later in the day so we could enjoy night skiing after class and then catch a ride home with them.

  35. Vicki Simons, Class of 1968

    I took several semesters of Folk Dancing but, looking back, I’m sorry I didn’t take advantage of skiing at Greek Peak. I ended up learning to ski at age 37 in Ohio at Snow Trails, a small resort created by covering a garbage dump with dirt.

  36. Lois Jordahl, Class of 1986

    Fall of my freshman year I took backpacking. Culmination of the class was an overnight trip – no idea where we went. We had a tarp angled down to the ground instead of a tent, and slept with our heads toward the closed end. We woke up with the tarp pretty much on our faces as it was weighted down with snow! When we got back to campus no one believed that it had snowed on us, since the weather at Cornell was lovely and warm that weekend!
    Next semester I took bowling, and I actually got a little bit better. I don’t remember anyone smoking at the lanes of Helen Newman though.

  37. Emily Slifkin, Class of 2018

    I became close with one of my best friends in Women’s Self-Defense. We became intimately acquainted with each other in strange self-defense positions. Then we would walk back to our dorm together (separate floors) and got to know each other!

    Then I took meditation which was basically a weekly nap time.

  38. Leslie Starr, Class of 1976

    I hated phys ed, and did my best to find classes where I didn’t need to change my clothes, didn’t break a sweat, and got in and out quickly. I recall taking riflery, canoeing, golf (hitting balls into a net) and archery. Might enjoy some of things more now that I’m retired!

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